Friday Fight: Iron Man Vs. Sex And The City
Even though Lindsay and Gabe are friends, they very rarely agree on anything. Every day, they have a fight about something. On Fridays, we publish one.
lindsay: The first time I saw the trailer for Iron Man I thought it was a joke
gabe: hahahah
lindsay: I thought iron man was going to be like 3 kings
lindsay: I thought it was about the war
gabe: had you ever heard of iron man?
lindsay: no
gabe: had you ever heard of spiderman?
lindsay: The first trailer premiered at comic con last year though or something
gabe: wait
gabe: you were at comicon?
lindsay: no, but it was released then
gabe: you were just catching up with your favorite comicon blogs
gabe: you're like "i don't know what any of the stuff they're talking about is, i just love comicon"
lindsay: I wrote about it for work
lindsay: here
gabe: your thought process in that post is so weird
gabe: i don't think anyone thought any of that that except you
lindsay: I stand completely behind that
gabe: A PSYCHOLOGICAL THRILLER BASED ON A PLAY?
lindsay: yeah!
lindsay: watching this, if you don't know it's going to be for a superhero movie, it's very comical and absurd
gabe: superhero movies are comical and absurd
lindsay: if you think it's a satire about the iraq war
lindsay: you're like "what is he making in the cave?"
lindsay: WHAT?
gabe: sure, except that it isn't a satire about the iraq war
gabe: and it's definitely not a PSYCHOLOGICAL THRILLER BASED ON A PLAy
gabe: i think that superhero movies are basically the male equivalent -- to make huge generalizations -- of shit like sex and the city
gabe: romantic comedies and superhero movies are two sides of the same coin
gabe: they fulfill the same purpose
lindsay: What I don't like about superhero movies is the fact that the stakes are so low
gabe: IS THE FATE OF THE WORLD A LOW STAKE?
gabe: the stakes aren't low in romantic comedies?
gabe: has a romantic comedy ever turned out with the couple not getting together?
lindsay: yes, The Break Up
lindsay: I loved it
gabe: i don't think that the stakes are what people care about
lindsay: and I absolutely hate in superhero movies where they show the news
gabe: yeah, i don't think anyone likes when they show the news
gabe: ever
gabe: in any movie
lindsay: and everyone accepts that there's this one guy in a costume who we really need right now to help us
gabe: if we wanted to be bored by the news, we would watch it at home
lindsay: and where is he?
gabe: well, they have to establish the reality somehow
gabe: like when we all prtend that carrie bradshaw is attractive
lindsay: hahaha
gabe: my favorite part of superhero movies are the origin sequences
gabe: like, when a character gets his powers
gabe: or as in batman when he goes and trains in the mountains
lindsay: I mean, nobody loved Batman more in 1989 than 13 year old Lindsay
lindsay: I had batman earrings, shorts, socks, shoelaces
hahaha
lindsay: I introduced myself to people by saying "Hey, I'm Lindsay. Do you like Batman?"
gabe: you were the ultimate fan when it came to Hot Topic's batman aisle
lindsay: for real
gabe: you ruled
lindsay: I saw it a ridiculous number of times in the theater
lindsay: I don't remember the number but it was like 12, and I would tell everyone that. I would update them on how many times.
gabe: so what happened?
lindsay: PUBERTY HAPPENED.
lindsay: The changes in your brain that make you unable to connect emotionally to a movie about a rich guy in a costume who saves the world.
gabe: who wants to connect emotionally?
lindsay: Oh come on!!
gabe: i want to punch people through cement walls
gabe: and because i cant
lindsay: You think grown men wouldn't be SO EXCITED for this movie if they didn't connect emotionally?
gabe: i want to see someone else do it
gabe: i think they do connect emotionally
gabe: sure
lindsay: Does Iron Man even HAVE a superpower?
gabe: no, he's more like batman
lindsay: or just a suit?
gabe: he's a billionaire who uses his money and privilege to develop himself into something
gabe: that poor people could never hope to be
lindsay: I mean, superhero movies and SATC are aspirational
gabe: agreed
lindsay: they're more about "I wish that was me" than about storytelling
gabe: agreed
gabe: do you think that movies generated for women that are unrealistic depictions of idealized romance, etc
lindsay: unfortunately, they're mostly about shoes and diamonds
gabe: are less infantile?
lindsay: yeah
gabe: and i am not conceding that superhero stuff is infantile either but that is your contention
lindsay: I think that with superhero movies and with SATC, it's not about the actual movie
lindsay:it's about having something in your life to identify with and be excited about
gabe: oh, that's not true
gabe: superhero movies it's all about the movie
gabe: in both instances actually
gabe: i mean, if the movie sucsk everyone is disappointed it's not like the dream lives on because of its symbolism
lindsay: yeah, but I don't think anyone will be disappointed with either of these movies
gabe: not these but people were disappointed in previous superhero movies for sure so the generalization doesn't work
lindsay: yeah, true
gabe: So, do you think that the romance movies are less juvenlie?
lindsay: no, but the ones I like are
lindsay: but they're darker
gabe: like what?
lindsay: like the break up or my best friend's wedding. they don't have happy endings.
gabe: i agree that any genre whose rules make it impossible for things to not turn out for the best are frustrating
gabe: although the one thing that superhero movies do is they never rest
gabe: there is no eternal peace. every time a villain is stopped, thre's another one to take its place
gabe: which is actually a pretty unhappy world view
lindsay: I think it would be cooler if superhero movies didn't try SO HARD to take place in the exact world that exists when they're made
gabe: unlike the success of a romatnic comedy that promises a lifetime of contentment
lindsay: like this one, with the troops in the desert
gabe: you don't like that a movie tries to speak to the relevant issues of the time in which its made?
lindsay: I think it's easier to believe the things they ask of you if you can just place it all in a different world
lindsay: if it can be like a fable
lindsay: I guess a comic book nerd would jump in here and say "you like sci/fi fantasy rather than superhero stuff"
gabe: people dont' really want to cut ties with reality
gabe: superheroes are a reaction to the real world
gabe: and the powerlessness that people feel in the face of huge, horrible things
lindsay: Well then where is the 9/11 superhero movie?
gabe: there have been superhero comics about 9/11 absolutely
gabe: but no one wants to actually see a movie based on that
gabe: it's too painful and close to the bone
gabe: it's macabre
gabe: if it's illustrated there's a distance
gabe: i want to see a romanitc comedy about 9/11
lindsay: I'm sure that one is in the works
gabe: it would be called P.S. I Love 9/11
gabe: it would be called Must Love Dogs, Hate Terrorism
lindsay: Something's Gotta Give (Tower 1)
gabe: hahahahah
gabe: ooph
gabe: My Best Friend's WEdding Was Tragically Canceled
gabe: we could do this all day and lose all of our readers
gabe: and we should
lindsay: How To Lose A Guy In 183 Minutes
gabe: hahahahahah
gabe: i'm laughing becuse it hurts
gabe: and is funny
gabe: The 10 Things I Hit With A Plane About You
lindsay: Failure To Launch
gabe: NO
gabe: too far, lindsay
gabe: too far
Posted by Gabe at 5:39 PM in Friday Fight
Tags: Batman | Iron Man | My Best Friend's Wedding | Robert Downey Jr. | Romantic Comedies | Sarah Jessica Parker | Sex And The City | Superheroes | The Break-Up
I'm with Lindsay on this one: I'm pretty much only realising today that Iron Man isn't another remake of the Ted Hughes children's book.
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actually, the scene in "the craft" where fairuza balk plays a trick on empire records by showing an "enchanted" newscast showing rempire records' parents dying in a firey plane crash is an example of a scene where i liked the news in movies.
THERE.
SUCK IT.
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it's Gabe's week to suck it.
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a 9/11 pun finale...that's so Samantha (she's the one who dies right? maybe? praying?)
I'd say Lindsay's got the W on this.
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I think Batman Begins is definitely a 9/11 superhero movie, and wrote as much at Flak Magazine: http://flakmag.com/film/batmanbegins.html
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Can't BELIEVE you liked Batman, Lindsay. If Michael Keaton's a super hero, my ass is a toaster oven.
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Why not just combine the two movies, give the Sex and the City girls iron suits... have them fight crime AND their own loneliness. Robert Downey Jr. can be the Charlie to their angels. Make the ultimate date movie. Do it. Now.
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Where's the fight in this Friday Fight?
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exactly there is no fight, they're like bla-bla-bla let's make out.
who wants to read that?
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I'd read it just for the 9/11 movies at the end.
I'd fucking read it again for the "How to Lose a Guy in 183 Minutes"
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@Rosen: Yes, Michael Keaton was an odd superhero, that was the point.
Like romantic comedies, there are rules for superhero films (ie - the superhero must look like a badass). Bending these rules is the only way to get something interesting.
Iron Man can be a compelling character because he bends another superhero rule, he's not a boyscout. He has serious character flaws (alcoholism, womanizing, ego to the point of stupidity) which give him depth... unless you twist them into perks, like in this film. He also has this aura of mortality... but that's essentially meaningless in a static superhero universe.
The fight of the piece should have been on this point: A chunk of us comic nerds are secretly waiting for some literary deconstruction of heroism (like an Astro City film or something), we just watch dudes punched through walls to pass the time. If fans of romantic comedies are just waiting for an unhappy ending (one of a dizzying two options), well, that's comparatively pathetic.
That being said, you'd probably enjoy "5x2," a bittersweet romantic comedy out of France in 2004.
(I suck at this.)
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Yeah, this fight was clearly about 9/11 puns, and lindsay won hands down.
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'How To Lose A Guy in 183 Minutes'?
OH MY GOD. That's like worse than Wonder-Showzen shocking.
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Don't get me wrong, I liked Lindsay's 911 movie titles, but "My Best Friend's Wedding was Tragically Canceled" probably made me laugh the most without feeling absolutely horrible about it.
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@Thomas B:
Yes, Michael Keaton was an odd superhero, that was the point.
We'll have to agree to disagree on this one, Thomas. Batman was SUPPOSED to be a superhero...not a little nervous, twitching sissy (as cast).
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i was really hoping this fight was going to be iron man vs. sex man.
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Yep, right up until he walked out of the cave in some crazy robot costume, I thought, "Hey, this look interesting!" and then..."Oh. It's one of THOSE movies..."
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Very entertaining! Love all the horrible 9/11 movie titles.
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27 Hijabs
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